[Transcribers note: The Cris Italia, or Stand Comedy Club mentioned here has had nothing to do with any of this, and is named by Patrick only out of his own stupidity] [0:00] J: Hey Patrick, it's Josiah. How are ya? P: Yes, Hi. I'm well. I'm going to step outside. It's pretty loud in here. J: Alright, no problem P: Okay, that's much better J: Perfect. So I understand there's been some pretty big developments over the past couple of days. Can you explain that? P: P: Yeah, I sent you some screengrabs, but without the context it probably doesn't help much. Basically what's happening is that two of the power users on the forums - namely Quasi, who is the Administrator. Quasi101, that is. And then SpaceEdge who has been the chief harassers and doxxers going back more than a year and a half now have been coming to blows. SpaceEdge believes that Quasi has worked either with another journalist named Seth Simons, or with my lawyers to sell out them and give up the identities of several of the most prolific of the forum users. This isn't actually true, but that's what he's got in his head, so we're just going to let him keep having that in his head. But anyway, because of this they've been getting increasingly angry with each other. [2:00] There's a growing rift amongst the community, and now that Canyon Boykin, who was the actual real life ID of SpaceEdge, believes that his information is getting out there. He's been much less careful about what he's saying in the group chats. What's happened is that we've found that what you and I were talking about the last time we spoke about the possibility of Quasi being funded from outside. it turns out that's true, and we even know who's doing it. His name is Cris Italia. He is the owner of the Stand, NYC, which is a comedy club that has been closely aligned with the alt-right. [3:00] So, Cris Italia is actually the one who's been funding most, if not all of the money for Quasi101's legal defense. What's more is that Canyon Boykin and several other people on the boards, like long time members of the boards like user Coonskin and CarolMaxheinie. They have inadvertently confirmed, for me at least, what Quasi101's identity is as well. We had a screengrab from a while ago that the mole had been talking about, where he had gotten a screengrab of an envelope that had the name Rahul Kumar on it, and an address there in the city. And I've told you before that I was much less confident about that ID, as I was with Canyon Boykin. [4:00] But that's no longer the case, because Canyon as well as several other people have in those shots that sent you have been using really anti-Indian slurs, specifically against Quasi. So, and between that and the fact that we now know that Cris Italia being in New York City is the one who's been funding this whole thing, to me that is confirmation that this Indian-American named Rahul Kumar who lives not even a mile away from The Stand comedy club. I think we can call that a positive identification at this point. [Transcribers note: WRONG] J: So, do you believe Rahul and Cris Italia know each other in person [5:00] P: Yes, I do J: Ok, that's very interesting P: Yes, I do J: So, does this turn the tables at all regarding your lawsuit in any way? P: I don't know how much it's going to help the lawsuit but now in a lot of ways the lawsuit is moot because the point of the lawsuit was to get Quasi101's identity so that we could depose him, and get confirmation of people like Canyon Boykin. Well, that's done now. At least to my satisfaction. The next phase no longer rests on this round of subpoenas and hearings going on in California and Wisconsin. [6:00] J: So that's good news then. You're going to be able to, I guess, subpoena Rahul and depose him? And find information on the rest of the members of the website. P: Possibly, this is all going to be up in the air. The next hearing is on the 23rd. The outcome of that hearing will determine whether or not we actually end up owing Rahul his legal fees of $17,000. Which we now know is money he owes to Cris Italia, but in a lot of ways even that's moot. Now, either with this article you're writing, or if I just go scorched Earth they're going to be named publicly anyway. Which is all of these people have been desperate to avoid, especially Canyon Boykin, with his history. [7:00] We don't know what he's doing for work anymore, but if it comes out "Oh hey, here's this disgraced ex-cop who probably got away with manslaughter of a black motorist, now it turns out that 5 years later he's moonlighting as a cyber-terrorist". I mean that's going to be a big fucking' story. It wouldn't surprise me if that ends up on national television. J: Right, okay P: And Canyon has taken great great pain to avoid being identified, because the last time he was dragged through the national media back in 2017. He has tried very hard. [8:00] He has no real social media presence, other than the occasional picture on his wife's Instagram account and Facebook. She does very little other than post pictures of their kids. They aren't out there. They've done their very best to scrub their numbers and their addresses and everything from all quarters of the internet to make it much harder to find. Presumably because they're just trying to put the whole thing with the death of Bell back in 2015, because the last time he just got dragged all to hell and back. [Transcribers note: Patrick says "Bell" but he should have said, "Ball" as in Ricky Ball, the deceased. He's very fat at this] Which would completely happen again. That's why he's so scared. J: Right. Now you said that the true source of this information is not Quasi or Rahul, but rather the mole. P: Yes, correct J: Can you give some more details about how valuable the mole's information has been in terms of your fight against this community. [9:00] P: The mole has been the only source we've had for any sort of information inside their inner circle. They had secret forums or secret chats set up which were not publicly visible, which is how they coordinate a lot of their stuff. But also it's been able to give us insight into the group's thinking at any given time. Because they put on the really brave bold face, that they aren't afraid of anything, that they're invincible. Blah blah blah. But in reality, once this lawsuit got started, they were scared shitless. They put on a brave face for a public face, but on the private side... That's the only reason you spend $17,000 of someone else's money, to try and keep your identity secret. [10:00] These guys have been freaking out for months over this stuff. J: Right. Actually, I noticed that Time had published an article about you P: Yesterday J: Yeah, yesterday. It seems they specifically target sci-fi and fantasy authors. Do you know why it is that they seem to go for that specific genre? P: Well it's not specifically sci-fi and fantasy authors. This group we're talking about does because they're trying to destroy me, and my reputation and my career. But other unaffiliated groups of stalkers and scammers and things like that, they go after whatever genre they want [11:00] J: I see. Well what role would you say the science fiction writers of America in helping you fight these trolls. I know that they helped in getting touch with higher ups at goodreads. How valuable have they been in your fight against this group? P: Immensely. If it hadn't been for some of their backdoor contacts into the administration staff at goodreads, there'd still be literally thousands absolutely wrecking my ratings. Across all six of my books. [12:00] Not just on good reads but on Amazon and other sites as well, so without their resource it would be an enormously uphill battle trying to continue my career. J: Right, I see. I had a few more questions actually. Earlier in the call you mentioned two other users, one I believe named "Coonskin" if that's correct P: Yeah, that's one of them J: And "Carol Maxinie"? P: CarolMaxHEINIE J: Yeah... Can you sort of explain their role in the forums and what they've done to affect your life. P: It's the same sort of thing [13:00] They're there to contribute to the harassment campaign. They're there to send harassing texts and leave harassing voicemails. CarolMaxheinie or CarolMaxinie, however they're pronouncing that. They're particularly upset with the outright lie that I cheat at half-marathons that I run. They claim to have discovered concrete evidence that at the 2016 Brewers Mini Marathon that I skipped timing mats and I don't appear where certain photographs are being taken. And therefore I must have cut the course. Even though that was by far my worst marathon time, because about 5 miles into it I stepped off a curb wrong, and twisted one of my ankles pretty good. So I ran the last 8 miles wincing. [14:00] Well, ran or walked. There's absolutely no way they could see the timing mat data. That's simply not public. There's no way... Every runner out of 5000 people, not everyone gets their picture taken at every photography stop. That's just not how any of this works. And I ran the entire race with a close friend who I've run several half marathons with. We didn't cut the course. We didn't cheat. There'd be no reason for me to cheat just so I could get a 2 hour and 40-minute time on a half marathon. People are just completely nuts. J: Right, yeah. Now that it seems a few of them are going to be identified, have you thought about what you're finally going to say to them once you see them face to face. Maybe even in a court room? [15:00] P: Well I'm hoping it's in the context of a criminal trial, especially in the case of Canyon Boykin because doxed dozens and dozens of people. He has been part of a conspiracy to harass through the telephone and through fax, dozens of people. He's tried to intimidate dozens of people. In fact, Paul Weimar, I gave him your email address so hopefully he'll be reaching out, but he's dealt with suicidal ideation over the past couple of years for a number of reasons, that are no fault of his own. People know that. And Canyon Boykin bragged openly about sending Paul texts demanding that he kill himself, and bragged about the fact that he was trying to convince Paul's brother that Paul is a pedophile. Which is a complete lie. This man is a criminal J: Yeah [16:00] P: And he's already literally gotten away with murder from the looks of it, and now he's moonlighting as a fucking cyberterrorist. I absolutely want to see him as he sits behind a desk, as I'm sitting on the witness stand as I'm explaining all his crimes to the jury. That's what I want to have happen J: Right, that's definitely understandable. Sorry, go ahead P: No that was it. J: Alright, well Patrick we did have a meeting yesterday morning, just to discuss the status of the article, and one major point that our managers brought up. I don't know where you are in terms of conferring with your lawyers, but we were discussing what it would take to have our readers take it seriously, and see it for what it is. [17:00] As I understand you have a video of one of these stalkers coming onto your property, and vandalising it. If we could show that to our readers that would be pretty invaluable in terms of getting people to read our article. In terms of coverage, and getting people to pay attention to our story. I don't know where you are in terms of conferring with your lawyer, but if you could get that to us that would be extremely helpful for the article. P: When do you believe this article might go live. What's the publication time frame? J: I'm thinking probably 3-4 weeks. [18:00] P: So early to mid-September J: Yeah, if you need to hold onto it for a little bit that's okay. Especially if you have to go with what, your lawyers say. Everything I'm saying... I'm just telling you what my bosses are saying. P: I'm thinking I'd probably feel better handing it over after our next hearing, which is in two weeks. J: Okay. And that's in two weeks, so that will be perfect P: September 23rd J: Alright, I just wanted to relay that message to you. Is there anything else you had to add? Any questions I haven't asked you, or anything else you have to say about this group? P: No, I don't think so. The revelation about Cris Italia is very interesting to me, that he is funding this from the outside. But it fits kind of nicely with what we know about his history. Oh, and the other thing, it appears to be, though they are unnamed at this point a video game developer at Rockstar games who is also a silent partner in all of this. So, this starts to kind of smack of Gamergate 2.0 sort of thing. With all of the toxicity culture that's come out of Bethesda games that's been in the news the last couple of weeks, with the strike and everything. That puts a very interesting wrinkle on all of this as well. J: Right...No Cris Italia used to be a member of the forums, correct? [20:00] P: Yes, he was J: So that will probably be his motivation... P: He may still be under a new username, but we know he used to be, based on an article from Seth Simons at the New Republic a couple of months back. Yeah, we know he was a user. A pretty big one As far as I can tell not one that did anything except point and laugh and be supportive of the terrible things they were doing to us. It's not exactly a situation that I can pin any particular heinous act against me or my family on Cris, except he was there pointing and laughing, and encouraging the whole thing. J: Yeah, that makes sense. That's all the questions I have for today, Patrick. [21:00] If anything changes, please make sure to let me know. I will definitely keep you updated as well. I appreciate you taking the time P: Absolutely, and like I said. And I think once we clear this next hearing and see what the outcome of that was then more than likely I'm going to go ahead and give you the images as well as the video clip, of the trespassing and the vandalism. J: Perfect, that would be very valuable. Alright Patrick, it was nice talking to you again. Hopefully we'll be in touch and I'll speak to you again soon. P: Alright, sounds good. Thanks for your time. Bye now. J: Bye.